Humanism and The Meaning of Life (help me with my RE project)

[Josey Wales]

They don't. They get absorbed in the intestines. They get absorbed so we can live, simply.

There are answers to most questions. Those that don't have definite answers have theories that can explain them. Humans are intelligent enough to rationalize things to the best of their knowledge.

The things we know may be wrong, but they make more sense than blind faith.

---------- Post added at 10:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:25 PM ----------



Because that is not possible, currently in humans. Possibly, through years of mutation/evolution, humans could have a stomach like that.

Ok, thats what I get for replying quick and not thinking to my medical training.

Why are nutrients absorbed in the intestines?
Why do humans need nutrients?
Why havent we evolved enough to not need food?

I can keep asking why and you can keep answering the questions but eventually all questions lead by to the why and eventually, without fail, there will be a last question with why without an answer. Thats all im saying.

 

[unconcentrated]

Read the whole of my post.

 

[Josey Wales]

My point is still intact.

We can rationalize to make our minds understand but that doesnt make it so. Going back to not knowing, like I said, we know what we know because we made it so, but that doesnt make it so in the overall aspect.

 

[unconcentrated]

There is no evidence to prove what we know to be false. Sure, it may happen, and it does. Science is a mutating being. We change scientific theories all the time. But, we're always certain that what we know is correct, for the time being.

 

[explosions]

There is no evidence to prove what we know to be false. Sure, it may happen, and it does. Science is a mutating being. We change scientific theories all the time. But, we're always certain that what we know is correct, for the time being.

You aren't seeing his point at all. You're arguing why you believe in something. He's saying you can't believe anything.

 

[Josey Wales]

There is no evidence to prove what we know to be false. Sure, it may happen, and it does. Science is a mutating being. We change scientific theories all the time. But, we're always certain that what we know is correct, for the time being.

That right there is exactly what I wanted to hear. Less black and white and more gray.

My work here is done.

 

[AndrewYY]

well basically:
science: well, we thought this, but new research suggests that... let's investigate.

religion: read this book. It was written thousands of years ago, but it's definitely the truth.

come on, what makes more sense here?

an argument that appeals to ignorance isn't worth anything. science doesnt claim absolute knowledge, but theism often does. what point is there even to be made?

 

[unconcentrated]

You aren't seeing his point at all. You're arguing why you believe in something. He's saying you can't believe anything.

..We're arguing two points. That's what a discussion is.

 

[AndrewYY]

You aren't seeing his point at all. You're arguing why you believe in something. He's saying you can't believe anything.

no, I think he is arguing that you cant know everything for sure. He's saying, you can rationalize your environment, but you can't know for sure what the absolute universe is like. I dont see how that is relevant. why care about the "real" universe? If it doesnt manifest in our subjective reality, why consider it?

 

[explosions]

no, I think he is arguing that you cant know everything for sure. He's saying, you can rationalize your environment, but you can't know for sure what the absolute universe is like. I dont see how that is relevant. why care about the "real" universe? If it doesnt manifest in our subjective reality, why consider it?

Well the posts I took the time to read, and not just skim through, gave me that impression. I'm not mentally intact right now, so don't judge me.

 

[elite]

Josey Wales, you are just saying that everything was placed based on a convention. Thus you can't 100% falsify neither 100% valid the significance or deduction. It is all tentative.

 

[FreePlay]

You will not be able to prove ANYTHING, EVER, AT ALL, IN EXISTANCE, for an 100% actual, undoubtful, impervious fact. And thats the truth, the only true fact in the world is that their are no facts

There are facts. Can we know them for sure? Possibly not. But there logically must be an objective reality, even if it's different for every person. Our reality has to be real, even if what we experience is an illusion. Even in The Matrix, there was still a real world.

 

[karakura]

There are facts. Can we know them for sure? Possibly not.

This is not an attack, and i agree with the rest of your point. But the definition of a fact is that it is verified and indisputable and thus if we cannot be sure then they are not facts

 

[Josey Wales]

Let me ask you something, before the turn of the millenium the entire world thought that Pluto was a planet and that was factual evidence proven by science. Then, all of a sudden science changed and Pluto no longer was a planet because of new evidence and research. New evidence changed what was a fact into a falsehood. Its this type of mentality where we think everything IS because we have proved it that I dont agree with.

Everything can change based on new information, we assume that the information we have now is the best and most correct - but the truth is that its the most up-to-date, not necessarily the most correct. We all think Democracy is the best governmental system, but its not... its just the best there is to our knowledge. We think black holes connect to other peices of the universe, but we have literally no way of proving that yet all science says its true. Science says its true because we invented the laws of figuring out science.

Our entire existence is based on the concept of our own race discovering OUR interpretation of reality. You really think the canine species has the same opinion about existence as the human species?

You can say that "intelligence" makes humans able to figure our the nature of our existence, but what makes humans so omnipotent? Where are we slated as being all knowing? Just because were at the top right now with the most ability to use intellect - that doesnt mean we always will be or wont evolve into something better. AND LETS SAY you dont believe in evolution, that supports my case even more - humans CANT be omnipotent with knowledge is a God exists, therefor any information and facts we have discovered in our lives is just best guess since humans cant be perfect.

This idea that, when we consider something a fact it cant be changed is not helpful to our growth as a species and especially not helping humanity.

 

[slicer4ever]

Let me ask you something, before the turn of the millenium the entire world thought that Pluto was a planet and that was factual evidence proven by science. Then, all of a sudden science changed and Pluto no longer was a planet because of new evidence and research. New evidence changed what was a fact into a falsehood. Its this type of mentality where we think everything IS because we have proved it that I dont agree with.

Pluto was declassified as a planet because we decided to change how we classify planet's, not because new information was brought to light about Pluto, or at least, that's how i understood why Pluto was de-classified as a planet

We think black holes connect to other peices of the universe, but we have literally no way of proving that yet all science says its true. Science says its true because we invented the laws of figuring out science.

i don't think anyone believes black hole's connect between two point's, i'm assuming you meant wormhole's, also, few scientist's have ever made the claim that that would be true(mostly in tv/movie science fiction is where people make these claims), and more often, it's labeled as a theory, because as you stated, we don't have any 100% sure proof yet to backup any of the proposed theory's(nor have we even observed a wormhole)

Our entire existence is based on the concept of our own race discovering OUR interpretation of reality. You really think the canine species has the same opinion about existence as the human species?

while i don't disagree, since we cannot communicate with most other species, we can only assume that they don't think about these things

This idea that, when we consider something a fact it cant be changed is not helpful to our growth as a species and especially not helping humanity.

QFT

i don't disagree with anything you said, but i did want to point out a few things in your argument =-)

 

[Josey Wales]

Pluto was declassified as a planet because we decided to change how we classify planet's, not because new information was brought to light about Pluto, or at least, that's how i understood why Pluto was de-classified as a planet


i don't think anyone believes black hole's connect between two point's, i'm assuming you meant wormhole's, also, few scientist's have ever made the claim that that would be true(mostly in tv/movie science fiction is where people make these claims), and more often, it's labeled as a theory, because as you stated, we don't have any 100% sure proof yet to backup any of the proposed theory's(nor have we even observed a wormhole)


while i don't disagree, since we cannot communicate with most other species, we can only assume that they don't think about these things


QFT

i don't disagree with anything you said, but i did want to point out a few things in your argument =-)

The point of the post was really merely to point out that what we know isnt the ultimate truth.

Pluto was a planet. He considered it one. Now you can say that we reclassified it, but thats jsut the same as saying we rediscovered new information. We found new information within ourselves that we decided was new and thus, the old had to be changed. Granted thats not hard scientific algebraic evidence, but its new evidence... in our hearts.

Blackhole, wormhole. You got the idea. Im glad that you brought of this as a theory, because I feel like our entire perception of what is true and false is merely just a theory. Our relationship to explaining existence and reality and life is merely just a theory since it can not be proved one way or another to an utmost certainty.

We can assume other species dont think about things like this but we can assume with the same authority that they do... thats the beauty of my whole talking point. The unknown is more substantial than the known, in my eyes.

 

[Bear 94]

Life on other planets hasn't supposedly had huge influence on us without leaving any traces at all.

Do I doubt aliens built the pyramids? Yes. Why? Well because there's absolutely no good evidence to prove it.
Do I doubt god exists? Yes. Why? Well because there's absolutely no good evidence to prove it.

It's all about using the train of skeptic logic you use to treat crackpot theories and applying it to things we are suppose to take as fact.

I have recently seen a documently that was few years old... and it was about all the evidence that pointed towards Jesus existing. If Jesus existed then doesn't that mean God exists too?

I for one don't believe in Aliens, and no one has proper evidence, and if people believe in aliens due to small evidence of life on other planets then the evidence of the bible, and the evidences found to prove Jesus existed.. doesn't that prove that God exists too?
I don't think you have to see something to believe it... but then everyone has different views and i'm in no position to critisize anyone about religion. Not really religious myself but i'm not an atheist for sure.

 

[Bear 94]

Hey everyone. I'm working on a project for my RE class in school, and the project is to do a case study on the meaning of life from a Secular Humanist point of view.
For the purposes of this project, I'm defining secular humanism as the non-religous belief that humans are nothing more but a result of evolution and the result of this, are separated from other forms of life by morality and self-awareness. As a result of this, secular humanists work to create a better society for everyone. Or, in this short quote:

I know a lot of people on this forum have non-religious views, so I feel this subforum is a great way to launch a debate on what life means to the non-religious. Please contribute your feelings on subjects like life, morality and the possibility of an afterlife. You will remain anonymous.
Oh, and does anyone know any other forums that would be a good place to post this? PM me if you do.

2011 EDIT: So back in September of last year, I got the results of the project back in. Full marks. Thanks MFM\eXo

Hi
I'm not sure if its the same project, but I have to do a similar project where i have to write a report on the differences and similarities of Christianity and Secular Humanists...
Do you have any good sites i could use.....?

 

[MenaceInc]

I have recently seen a documently that was few years old... and it was about all the evidence that pointed towards Jesus existing. If Jesus existed then doesn't that mean God exists too?

I for one don't believe in Aliens, and no one has proper evidence, and if people believe in aliens due to small evidence of life on other planets then the evidence of the bible, and the evidences found to prove Jesus existed.. doesn't that prove that God exists too?
I don't think you have to see something to believe it... but then everyone has different views and i'm in no position to critisize anyone about religion. Not really religious myself but i'm not an atheist for sure.

Jesus, the man, could certainly have existed. A 33 year old Jewish carpenter who had a revelation and preached to the masses until he was crucified by the Romans. Crucifying was a common method of punishment back then and there were certainly a number of preachers then as there are now.

The existence of a single man does not prove the existence of a deity though. As for using the Bible for evidence of the existence of a God, that's a really bad idea. The Bible as we know it is a collection of books and letters written thousands of years ago and mis-translated many times.

Here is an article that goes over the mis-translation of the name Lucifer. This is just a single word within the Bible. There are many instances like this throughout the whole book.

 

[Therealluigigamer97]

My opinion is kinda simple. The human being will not understand what is love or what is peace. ¿Why?...Because it doesn´t love what it haves or what it means to be alive.