God Talk

[eighty4]

i went to a catholic high school taking mandatory religion classes every day while attending mandatory mass and prayer services. i have studied each sacrament, the old and new testaments, and modern catholicism and moral obligations in depth.

jesus does not equal god to them. he is part of the holy trinity made of god the father (creator), god the son (redeemer), and god the spirit (sanctifier). i was taught (by an actual priest) that god creates each person individually, from scratch. I once asked him what he meant by that when we have direct physical evidence of the sperm and eggs combining to create whole chromosomes then that single cell multiplying and dividing etc. and he just insisted that each person was made from scratch by god and that sex was just a way of letting god know to get going.

there is a few problems i have with that answer.
1. god created each person from scratch, and since there is no evidence that being raised a certain way makes you gay, then it is most likely biological. meaning that god created his own abomination.

2. why have sex to let god know that you are ready for a baby? why not just pray? also, if you use a condom you are still having sex, so wouldn't god know anyway?

3. god could make babies instantly so why does it take nine months?

in case you are wondering i did actually ask him those and instead of even trying to answer me he gave me a four hour Saturday detention and the number of a religious counselor so i could discuss my "problems" with him. whats ironic is that i had biology next period and since cal. state law requires we be taught a certain curriculum i spent the next hour learning about anthropology, which to this day remains an area of great interest to me, and one of the choices that i am considering majoring in

That part sounds bogus, you need to talk to this guy.

1) Gays won't "abominate" the Christian faith rather than be opposed to it.

2) God knows all so why would you need to tell God you want a baby if your heart is already set on it? (You should probably ask a Pastor or someone for THIS answer)

3) Would you really see a woman become pregnant right after you have sex with her, then have her pop the baby out? God plans everything.

 

[Darth Budd]

That part sounds bogus, you need to talk to this guy.

1) Gays won't "abominate" the Christian faith rather than be opposed to it.

2) God knows all so why would you need to tell God you want a baby if your heart is already set on it? (You should probably ask a Pastor or someone for THIS answer)

3) Would you really see a woman become pregnant right after you have sex with her, then have her pop the baby out? God plans everything.

did you read the part where i said he was a priest?

 

[eighty4]

So are alot of rapist. Either way, what he's saying is either what he HIMSELF thinks is true, or just total garbage. It doesn't even sound logical in faith. Why would you need to have sex to tell God that you want a baby?

 

[Darth Budd]

i don't know, but another priest confirmed it. they basically refused to believe anything even remotely science-y, no matter the supporting evidence.

 

[eighty4]

i don't know, but another priest confirmed it. they basically refused to believe anything even remotely science-y, no matter the supporting evidence.

Well I've been going to a Church where we view things in the Bible as truth but sometimes exaggerated to show a true point. Like people living for 900+ years etc. It's a mix of using what we know from facts around the world and what the Bible says in text.

 

[Darth Budd]

Well I've been going to a Church where we view things in the Bible as truth but sometimes exaggerated to show a true point. Like people living for 900+ years etc. It's a mix of using what we know from facts around the world and what the Bible says in text.

i went to a catholic high school where the teachers gave you detentions for asking questions about the religion. we were expected to sit down, shut up, and take it. they built a whole series of new classrooms because we were expanding but we couldn't use it because for six months until cardinal mahoney came down to bless it.

 

[FreePlay]

Why would you need to have sex to tell God that you want a baby?

......

This is your brain on the Bible, kids.

 

[ChurchedAtheist]

1. god created each person from scratch, and since there is no evidence that being raised a certain way makes you gay, then it is most likely biological. meaning that god created his own abomination.

2. why have sex to let god know that you are ready for a baby? why not just pray? also, if you use a condom you are still having sex, so wouldn't god know anyway?

3. god could make babies instantly so why does it take nine months?

1. "they weren't born that way, our evil godless society perverted them"
2 + 3. "god works in mysterious ways"


/standard christian answer

......

This is your brain on the Bible, kids.

we need a laughing smiley. because things like that make me lol.

 

[Darth Budd]

1. "they weren't born that way, our evil godless society perverted them"
2 + 3. "god works in mysterious ways"


/standard christian answer

oh i know, it's their way of avoiding a question, but still feeling that they won an argument.

 

[ChurchedAtheist]

oh i know, it's their way of avoiding a question, but still feeling that they won an argument.

the fact that "God is on their side" means they cant ever loose any argument. EVER.

 

[Darth Budd]

for he shall smite them if they do

 

[Terra]

Now I know those of you are committed to science & have no part of God or religion (Which I accept) but I wonder what you think of this.

Hypothetical of course.

In regard to those passages, in the bible (& they are numerous) that are contradictory etc. about all seeing, all knowing, are written by humans, "scribes" of their times.
We also know that religion uses fear & threats to keep it's followers in line.

My question is this.
If God was to "Giveth & taketh" of all things, that is, protecting babies,loving mothers, pillars of society, New York bicycle couriers & Afghan camel jockeys etc. What would be the purpose of giving us the capacity to determine our own direction?
It is accepted, whether or not one is a believer, that God has claimed he is all powerful & capable of anything, but if he constantly exercised these powers, would we progress "naturally"?

If he has given us the tools, why would he make them redundant?

If you just want to ridicule this, you can, If you can't be bothered, that's fine as well, but this is a debating forum & in it's process we all hope to advance & expand the thought process & perhaps our knowledge & understanding, hence the questions.

 

[FreePlay]

Yes, I'm committed to science. I'm committed to reason, logic, and deduction. As for having no part of god or religion, if someone can give me some objective evidence of his existence, I'll be forced to accept it.

It is accepted, whether or not one is a believer, that God has claimed he is all powerful & capable of anything

I would hardly say that's accepted. The Biblical God couldn't do something that was inherently contradictory to his nature.

As for the rest of white you said, I'm not sure what you're trying to say, and I'm especially confused by the use of the derogatory 'camel jockey'...

 

[Terra]

They were pretty simple questions mate, a hypothetical about a God that used his powers to achieve his own ends & not necessarily what His "Subjects" may want. "If he's given us the tools" why interfere?

As for "and I'm especially confused by the use of the derogatory 'camel jockey'..."

OK, let me ask you why you didn't find the "New York bicycle courier" offensive.

Just for the record though, It was in reference to the most & least recognized
Loving mothers to Afghan camel jockey's. A comparison.

Google it. In several countries around the world they race Camels.
In this country, there is a rich history of Afghan Camels. In fact one of our tourist icons is "The 'Ghan" (We shorten everything) which is an old railway system in the top end.
As far as we're concerned, anyone that rides an animal in a race, is a jockey. How do you consider that to be derogatory?

You need to lighten up mate.

 

[FreePlay]

Where I live, "camel jockey" is used as a racist term for Arabs.

As for your questions, they're far from simple, because they start with all sorts of assumptions about what god would be like, and what the effects of his actions would be.

And I'm plenty lightened up when it comes to things that aren't this important.

 

[Seth]

Where I live, "camel jockey" is used as a racist term for Arabs.

Me being Arabic I can say that is true in Detroit as well I do get called that once in a while... But black teens call us sand nigger now

 

[Terra]

I guess everybody, in a spirited mind of mirth, likes to be condescending, particularly those that have a negative sense of self esteem, even if it's minor. It gives them a boost, but if they reflect, they may realize that it's like turning on a Neon light above their head that says "I need to step on someone to lift my spirits",,, & that is pretty poor form.

Re the Jockeys. If I can digress.
The real humour down here for that reference actually comes from an event when two blokes decided to race each other on Afghan camels in the Todd River, to raise funds for charity. Being the only two camel jockeys in the country, they were pretty rare. That was almost 40 years ago though, but the tradition lives on in an annual "Camel Cup".
The Todd river runs through the desolate Red centre & Alice Springs, & is dry 90% of the time.
I understand that Virginia city in Nevada has a major two day event as well.

Having read your posts I now understand your concern, but you'll have to forgive my humour, but it occurred to me, given the large population of Arabic communities over there, & that these camel races are for charity, I wondered what a local business owned or run by an expat Arab would think if one of these riders approached them & said "Hi, I'm a camel jockey trying to raise funds for charity"
He may well need a bit of charity himself.

 

[Darth Budd]

Now I know those of you are committed to science & have no part of God or religion (Which I accept) but I wonder what you think of this.

Hypothetical of course.

In regard to those passages, in the bible (& they are numerous) that are contradictory etc. about all seeing, all knowing, are written by humans, "scribes" of their times.
We also know that religion uses fear & threats to keep it's followers in line.

My question is this.
If God was to "Giveth & taketh" of all things, that is, protecting babies,loving mothers, pillars of society, New York bicycle couriers & Afghan camel jockeys etc. What would be the purpose of giving us the capacity to determine our own direction?
It is accepted, whether or not one is a believer, that God has claimed he is all powerful & capable of anything, but if he constantly exercised these powers, would we progress "naturally"?

If he has given us the tools, why would he make them redundant?

If you just want to ridicule this, you can, If you can't be bothered, that's fine as well, but this is a debating forum & in it's process we all hope to advance & expand the thought process & perhaps our knowledge & understanding, hence the questions.

you just confirmed nearly everything that i have been saying

 

[Terra]

How have I confirmed anything? I'm not asserting an opinion, I'm asking for yours.

 

[Darth Budd]

you told us that god made us independent, then asked why he meddled in our affairs, that sir makes no sense, and takes away credibility from your position.