God Talk

[Vee]

So you guys are saying, God should prevent everything bad that ever happens on Earth?

What are you insane? I dont care if you think thats an "excuse" for me. It isn't, its my belief and no one can prove me wrong. Whats stupid is that you lot think that God should/is being tested. Certain things i believe God does intervene with, its just some people are too careless/thick to realize.

 

[Grimfate126]

So you guys are saying, God should prevent everything bad that ever happens on Earth?

What are you insane? I dont care if you think thats an "excuse" for me. It isn't, its my belief and no one can prove me wrong. Whats stupid is that you lot think that God should/is being tested. Certain things i believe God does intervene with, its just some people are too careless/thick to realize.

like what?

 

[Moose]

So you guys are saying, God should prevent everything bad that ever happens on Earth?

What are you insane? I dont care if you think thats an "excuse" for me. It isn't, its my belief and no one can prove me wrong. Whats stupid is that you lot think that God should/is being tested. Certain things i believe God does intervene with, its just some people are too careless/thick to realize.

It doesn't take intelligence to believe in God. I could decide to believe in God right now... but that wouldn't be intelligent at all, would it? Neither does it take care to believe in God. If anything, it takes carelessness and a lack of intelligence not to realise that there is in fact nothing beyond the realm of a physical existence.

But that's just what I believe, so I'm not wrong. [/sarcasm]

It's ignorant to state that your belief is correct, because you have no idea whether it is or isn't correct. You can't prove to me that what you believe is correct, so what exactly makes you correct in believing in God?

 

[gr34t3st]

The fact is you cannot prove that there is a God. Religion is based on faith as it's foundation. It's incredible how much people put into something that they cannot prove exists. It's your decision though.

 

[PSPHax0r9]

Your idea of god and free will are at odd with almost every other theist I've talked to. They all describe feeling touched by god, coming to them in their dreams, answering their prayers, getting guidance from him and countless other experiences that involve him (her?) interfering in their lives.

They might be describing feelings of how they felt God in those cases, but in most cases you're probably talking to more conservative Catholics. I don't believe in some super-controlling, micromanaging God. That's my personal belief. I don't know what other people believe.

But even from what I've read in religion books and everything, the general consensus among religious scholars seems to be that free will is in some way sacred, in fact it was the main reason for the split between Catholics and Lutherans.

But the fact that he DOES give us free will has tremendously hurt mankind and does more harm than good.

There's no quantifiable way to prove that. Just the virtue of having control over your actions could easily be considered a good in itself.

F*** is a bad word which is looked down on by your God.

Really? I highly doubt that God gives two fucks what I say unless it really hurts someone else or is highly offensive. Even then, I have free will, so who gives a fuck?

It WAS the man's free will but if it was given to him by God then...Correct me if I'm wrong but predestination is the belief that God already knows whether or not we're going to Heaven or Hell. If that's the case then God knows our future and ultimately we are acting out of premeditated plan, which of course is not free will...

No, predestination is the belief that God predestines each one of us to go to heaven or hell before birth and that we can do nothing in life to change that. And not to mention I said that I DON'T subscribe to predestination. Please actually read my posts. Thanks.

 

[ChurchedAtheist]

F*** is a bad word which is looked down on by your God.

where does it say that in the bible?

 

[PSPHax0r9]

So you guys are saying, God should prevent everything bad that ever happens on Earth?

What are you insane? I dont care if you think thats an "excuse" for me. It isn't, its my belief and no one can prove me wrong. Whats stupid is that you lot think that God should/is being tested. Certain things i believe God does intervene with, its just some people are too careless/thick to realize.

How does he choose? How come one person gets helped and another doesn't? Is it random? If it's random then does God really love us? If not then does God love some people more than others? Is that contradictory to the whole nature of a God?

This is why I don't buy that. It's such a flawed premise.

 

[Adiuvo]

where does it say that in the bible?

Foul language is mentioned as a nono in the bible, but no specific words.

 

[PSPHax0r9]

The fact is you cannot prove that there is a God. Religion is based on faith as it's foundation. It's incredible how much people put into something that they cannot prove exists. It's your decision though.

That's the point, because there are some things that can't be proven or disproven. In that case it comes down to faith. That's where religion comes into play. And once again, like you said, it's a choice.

 

[ChurchedAtheist]

Foul language is mentioned as a nono in the bible, but no specific words.

are you referring to the 'tame your tongue' thing in one of the letters to timothy(forget if it's 1st or 2nd)?

 

[gr34t3st]

where does it say that in the bible?

Some Examples:

Ephesians 4:29
"Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen."

First Peter 3:10
"For, whoever would love life and see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from deceitful speech."

James 3:9-12
"With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water."

I'm sure there are more...
Obviously, one could argue that the word "f***" is not a "bad" word but in my society and natural ethic, it IS an unwholesome word.

Really? I highly doubt that God gives two fucks what I say unless it really hurts someone else or is highly offensive. Even then, I have free will, so who gives a fuck?

It actually offends me, which is one reason why I don't write the word out in my posts. The other is respect of other members of this forum that don't want to hear crap like that. I'm not a christian but I have my own morals and ethics. Cursing is not on my OK list. Sorry.

No, predestination is the belief that God predestines each one of us to go to heaven or hell before birth and that we can do nothing in life to change that. And not to mention I said that I DON'T subscribe to predestination. Please actually read my posts. Thanks.

Predestination (also linked with foreknowledge) is a religious concept, which involves the relationship between God and His creation. The religious character of predestination distinguishes it from other ideas about determinism and free will. Those who believe in predestination, such as John Calvin, believe that before the creation God determined the fate of the universe throughout all of time and space. Predestination is a decree by God that there are certain souls that were previously appointed to salvation.

This contradicts free will. This belief is telling us that we are acting out his plan. You may disagree whether this contradicts that idea or not but I think it's pretty dang close.

Also, where did I say you did subscribe to that idea? For all you know I could have been talking to someone else, or just pointing out a fact. I was actually just bashing the average Christian belief. Please read MY posts before trying to counter argue me. Thanks.

 

[PSPHax0r9]

Some Examples:

Ephesians 4:29
"Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen."

First Peter 3:10
"For, whoever would love life and see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from deceitful speech."

James 3:9-12
"With the tongue we praise our Lord and Father, and with it we curse men, who have been made in God's likeness. Out of the same mouth come praise and cursing. My brothers, this should not be. Can both fresh water and salt water flow from the same spring? My brothers, can a fig tree bear olives, or a grapevine bear figs? Neither can a salt spring produce fresh water."

I'm sure there are more...

Oh, pshht, all those are saying is that you should be nice to people. Unless you take the Bible completely literally all the time and follow it to the letter.

It actually offends me, which is why I don't write the word out in my posts. I'm not a christian but I have my own morals and ethics. Cursing is not on my OK list. Sorry.

Too bad, I've got free will, so fuck that

This contradicts free will. This belief is telling us that we are acting out his plan. You may disagree whether this contradicts that idea or not but I think it's pretty dang close.

Also, where did I say you did subscribe to that idea? For all you know I could have been talking to someone else, or just pointing out a fact. I was actually just bashing the average Christian belief. Please read MY posts before trying to counter argue me. Thanks

I still have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. You cited a Wikipedia article that agrees with what I said. And then you agree with what I said.

Hmmm? Why would I think that you were talking to me in your post? It couldn't have been the fact that you quoted me directly above...

And if you were talking about the average Christian belief then you're wrong there too. Considering that it's a Calvinist Protestant belief, and they are not the majority of Christians.

Your posts just don't make sense at points. You post like you're disagreeing with me yet you're agreeing. Chain of events: I said that predestination was stupid, and then you go on to quote me and say that predestination is stupid like you're contradicting me, and then I go and tell you that I never said that I agreed with predestination, and then you go and agree that I never said that, yet you still post like you're contradicting me!

 

[gr34t3st]

Oh, pshht, all those are saying is that you should be nice to people. Unless you take the Bible completely literally all the time and follow it to the letter.

Then be nice to me and stop using the f word.

Too bad, I've got free will, so fuck that

Exactly... BUT you don't need to believe in God to believe in free will. You could say the F word whether you believed or not.

I still have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. You cited a Wikipedia article that agrees with what I said. And then you agree with what I said.

Hmmm? Why would I think that you were talking to me in your post? It couldn't have been the fact that you quoted me directly above...

I quoted you for reference to the topic, not to argue.

And if you were talking about the average Christian belief then you're wrong there too. Considering that it's a Calvinist Protestant belief, and they are not the majority of Christians.

I have no reference or counter for that. I have no clue what the dominant Christian belief is. I was solely talking about the average Christian in my area and the ones I talk to every day. At my old church they believed in this so I went along with it thinking it was average for Christianity.
You caught me speaking out of ignorance. Got me.

Your posts just don't make sense at points. You post like you're disagreeing with me yet you're agreeing. Chain of events: I said that predestination was stupid, and then you go on to quote me and say that predestination is stupid like you're contradicting me, and then I go and tell you that I never said that I agreed with predestination, and then you go and agree that I never said that, yet you still post like you're contradicting me!

I'm agreeing with you in the sense that you are disagreeing with the idea of predestination. I am contradicting you though.. just not about predestination.

I'm disagreeing with the person behind the monitor reading these and are murmuring disagreements under their breath.

 

[PSPHax0r9]

Ok so I think...we basically agree. And basically what you're saying is that you were trying to flesh out the issue not contradict me.

Well OK then. Looks like everything is good.

The only thing is that one comment about free will. I'm not saying that you have to believe in God to have free will, I'm saying that a belief in God does not negate free will.

 

[gr34t3st]

The different branches of Christianity make it hard to just narrow it down to one belief.
Sometimes it seems like Christianity, itself, is contradicting Christianity.

Parting Note: IMO Predestination and Free-Will contradict each other and any religion that believes both are utter BS and the fact that even religious leaders around me cannot explain why they don't contradict each other, proves it's ridiculousness. I'm done (unless I feel the urge to argue someones post or someone quotes me )

 

[ChurchedAtheist]

@gr34t3st: those are all about the content and meaning of what you say. fuck is not a bad word by nature. saying 'god is fucking awesome' violates none of those you posted.

 

[gr34t3st]

In my morals and ethics, that is an unwholesome word, like I mentioned. You simply think you're right because you found a loophole in the Bible... You know that the f word is a not harmless word when used in certain circumstances. Obviously people don't like it or it wouldn't be considered a swear word.

In that sense it IS going against the Bible.

...But only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

You should know when to use it and when not to use it. Let's say for example you were in the same room as a person who simply hates swearing. You say the F word even though you know they don't like it. You don't have the respect for them to withhold from saying it. There are countless substitutes for the word and yet you have to pick the one that is perhaps the most offensive to them and their own ethics.

In that example, it is going against the Bible completely. But who are we to decide? It really doesn't matter when you think about it. It's 100% due to respect whether or not you say it.

You don't call an African-American the "N" word because it's wrong. The "N" word isn't a bad word. It's simply the Spanish word for black. Yet, we don't say it because it's offensive, insulting, and wrong. If you do say it in a negative and insulting way then you are a low life with no intelligence and no respect. I view it closely to that topic.

In my morals, the F word is offensive and if you say it to me knowing full well I don't like it then it shows you don't have very strong morals yourself. Maybe the word itself doesn't break the Bible's rules, but in the context you use it, it might. It's all circumstantial.

 

[buckeyegamer]

Should we start a poll just to see the picture of the forums user base?
It will not solve any disagreements but it would be interesting to see.

 

[gr34t3st]

PMed a mod about this and awaiting approval.

 

[eighty4]

You don't call an African-American the "N" word because it's wrong. The "N" word isn't a bad word. It's simply the Spanish word for black. Yet, we don't say it because it's offensive, insulting, and wrong. If you do say it in a negative and insulting way then you are a low life with no intelligence and no respect. I view it closely to that topic.

Negro is Spanish for black. And it's not pronounced the same either.