• Steam recently changed the default privacy settings for all users. This may impact tracking. Ensure your profile has the correct settings by following the guide on our forums.

Piracy

Davee

Davee

lolhax
Copyright breach is unfair towards the developers and only benefit the actual pirate. Piracy is an act of selfishness and greed powered by an ignorance in software development and how much work gets put into software nowadays. There is no justification for stealing, so why even bother to attempt to create one?
The fight with software developers against piracy is going to get ugly as long as it continues to harm sales.
 
B

brnards13

New Member
But guys, here in Brazil a UMD cust like 200 reias (90 dolars). The minimum wage here is 400 reias so we spend about 22.5% of own salary in 1 UMD.

Thats why we need ISOLoader, to test the game, and after, if we like it, BUY !

=*

PS: I Use google translator for my portuguenglish :p
 
J

jeerum

PeeruEnn
If you use pirate soft, then who pay for developers for making greater soft?
But i thinking, all software must have trial version.
 
W

WildArmsV

New Member
brnards13 said:
But guys, here in Brazil a UMD cust like 200 reias (90 dolars). The minimum wage here is 400 reias so we spend about 22.5% of own salary in 1 UMD.

Thats why we need ISOLoader, to test the game, and after, if we like it, BUY !

=*

PS: I Use google translator for my portuguenglish :p
Click to expand...

Yeah i live in Venezuela (above brazil) the game prices are just too much, i only buy games when a friend go to USA and i buy them with amazon, so those little chances i have like twice a year i have to really take advantage and dont waste the little dollars we can use (because yeah, dollars exchange from my currency is limited, because ppl sell the dollar too high, more high than the official dollar, so the goverment made the dollars usage with the credit card limited).
I prefer 100 times original games, but if i dont like a game i cant just go to gamespot and sell it there, or get cheaper used games, so i must really be sure when i buy a game, thanks to god for youtube and gameplay videos

By the way the limit of dollars i can use a YEAR (official dollar from my credit card) is 400$ -.-
 
Y

yellowdrops

New Member
Would be great if games had a 5 hours long (of playing game, not clock hours) trial version, so ppl could see if they like it and buy it...

But in other thought, minor game creators would never sell anyhting.

I think that at some places the prices are way over the reality, but this is not a justify to piracy. Im from Brasil and already told to all my folks that if you support piracy, you are supporting a person who pays you a payment 5 times lower of the average, as long as you do not repect other ppls work, you cannot ask to someone to respect yours.
 
J

jeerum

PeeruEnn
Think this. If you create a application - you will sell it some price
say "100$", but one person get it and make copy.
Now nobody buying this anymore after years of work :)
 
J

jeerum

PeeruEnn
ok, i explainet this in estonia too, it same, you get to working and money take another people :) How long you can work with that.
 
T

Telpeurion

New Member
Davee said:
Copyright breach is unfair towards the developers and only benefit the actual pirate. Piracy is an act of selfishness and greed powered by an ignorance in software development and how much work gets put into software nowadays. There is no justification for stealing, so why even bother to attempt to create one?
The fight with software developers against piracy is going to get ugly as long as it continues to harm sales.
Click to expand...

Haha, the Horse and Buggy camp had similar arguments. The point is I and many others (perhaps not on these forums) have great arguments as to why copyright and intellectual property at large are means that do not achieve their original stated ends. You won't even face those arguments though. Instead you call names, labeling people 'pirates' and saying they stole something. What did they steal? There is an inert difference between physical property and so-called intellectual property.

As for justification, why do I need a justification if it is not stealing? You know what it is really is about is that these businesses do not want to change their business models and thus, in a free market, they are meant to fail. I mentioned earlier in the thread how there are many successful developers who thrive because of and despite "piracy", its free distribution and advertising. Geez, I wonder how these pirates have time for raiding sea vessels, they must be leaving torrents on all night!

Either way, tell me it is possible to steal when you don't actually take anything. To be sure, copyright generates profit FOR ONE GROUP, and that is the copyright owner, that is what is seen. But what is not seen? How many persons couldn't capitalize on THEIR ideas because they conflicted with a copyright, preventing innovation and competition. How long should a copyright last, should it be renewed? You leave economic thinking to government planners who have no grasp on the billions of decisions that happen every hour from individuals. In the end, even the copyright owner is worse off because of the lost opportunities. You guys only speak of games, so I'll talk about games.

How many excellent games never game to fruition because they conflicted with a copyright? Why can't you or I, or Sony, make a Mario game? Or Zelda? Or Final Fantasy? Why can't we add our own ideas? Hell, even a harmless little flash game featuring a trademarked character are shut down? Remember the 3D Chrono Trigger project? Trashed. Oh, and that's just one example.
 
N

NoEffex

Seth's On A Boat.
Telpeurion said:
Haha, the Horse and Buggy camp had similar arguments. The point is I and many others (perhaps not on these forums) have great arguments as to why copyright and intellectual property at large are means that do not achieve their original stated ends. You won't even face those arguments though. Instead you call names, labeling people 'pirates' and saying they stole something. What did they steal? There is an inert difference between physical property and so-called intellectual property.

As for justification, why do I need a justification if it is not stealing? You know what it is really is about is that these businesses do not want to change their business models and thus, in a free market, they are meant to fail. I mentioned earlier in the thread how there are many successful developers who thrive because of and despite "piracy", its free distribution and advertising. Geez, I wonder how these pirates have time for raiding sea vessels, they must be leaving torrents on all night!

Either way, tell me it is possible to steal when you don't actually take anything. To be sure, copyright generates profit FOR ONE GROUP, and that is the copyright owner, that is what is seen. But what is not seen? How many persons couldn't capitalize on THEIR ideas because they conflicted with a copyright, preventing innovation and competition. How long should a copyright last, should it be renewed? You leave economic thinking to government planners who have no grasp on the billions of decisions that happen every hour from individuals. In the end, even the copyright owner is worse off because of the lost opportunities. You guys only speak of games, so I'll talk about games.

How many excellent games never game to fruition because they conflicted with a copyright? Why can't you or I, or Sony, make a Mario game? Or Zelda? Or Final Fantasy? Why can't we add our own ideas? Hell, even a harmless little flash game featuring a trademarked character are shut down? Remember the 3D Chrono Trigger project? Trashed. Oh, and that's just one example.
Click to expand...

The developers deserve every penny that their application, music, etc produce. It is completely unfair that it's stolen. I think you are not aware how many people use torrents and pirate.

Say you go through years and years of hard work and you FINALLY have an elaborate product that is just awesome. Then, some huge company comes along and STEALS your idea and makes all the money off it, while you go out of business because your product didn't sell, and better yet, the bigger company can claim they made the original, and that yours is BS.

You can't make any of those games because it is Nintendo's(Or one of their subset companies etc) invention and you would simply be profiting from their hard work while they see none of it.

It's a cut-throat industry.
 
T

Telpeurion

New Member
ServerPlague said:
I have to disagree there. If I make something then it should be mine to use unless I wish to share it in which case people can buy it as long as they respect the fact that I made it.

It's not about having a monopoly on the market, it's about respecting the fact that somebody put in the hard work to make something. You can't just assume that you deserve something that somebody else made.
Click to expand...

Haha, what do you mean make something? If you manufacture a book, sure you OWN it. You own the paper, the ink, and the bindings. Those are physical properties! If you do not want to share an idea with someone else, go ahead, keep it locked in your head. What are you afraid of? That someone else might come along and make better use of your idea? Oh, and by saying "You can't just assume that you deserve something that somebody else made", you just assume that you own concepts in other peoples' heads and by extension anything they do with their "hard work". If I make a PSP with my own materials, with my labor, isn't it mine? Yet you say Sony owns it? You contradict yourself!
 
N

NoEffex

Seth's On A Boat.
Telpeurion said:
Haha, what do you mean make something? If you manufacture a book, sure you OWN it. You own the paper, the ink, and the bindings. Those are physical properties! If you do not want to share an idea with someone else, go ahead, keep it locked in your head. What are you afraid of? That someone else might come along and make better use of your idea? Oh, and by saying "You can't just assume that you deserve something that somebody else made", you just assume that you own concepts in other peoples' heads and by extension anything they do with their "hard work". If I make a PSP with my own materials, with my labor, isn't it mine? Yet you say Sony owns it? You contradict yourself!
Click to expand...

No, they have no right to make the thing better and profit for the entire thing, as you, the original author and the person who spent ALL the time that you did on it got jipped out of the entire payload. It's completely unfair.
 
T

Telpeurion

New Member
NoEffex said:
The developers deserve every penny that their application, music, etc produce. It is completely unfair that it's stolen. I think you are not aware how many people use torrents and pirate.

Say you go through years and years of hard work and you FINALLY have an elaborate product that is just awesome. Then, some huge company comes along and STEALS your idea and makes all the money off it, while you go out of business because your product didn't sell, and better yet, the bigger company can claim they made the original, and that yours is BS.

You can't make any of those games because it is Nintendo's(Or one of their subset companies etc) invention and you would simply be profiting from their hard work while they see none of it.

It's a cut-throat industry.
Click to expand...

Well, lets not get into the realm of saying who deserves what, all we can say is who wants what. If the consumers like my version of Mario better than yours, complain all you want, they still like mine better. Yours is a purely hypothetical argument. If I release my product before them, wouldn't it be silly for them to advertise that they made it first when in fact they did not? Why is their product more successful than mine? Do they have better marketing? Do they have a better product itself? What stops another business from making their own version of the project? All these questions and more need to be answered.

To the point though, if I cannot sell my product, and since we are talking about "deserving" things, I do not "deserve" to be in business. After all, even if I had monopoly production of the product, it would still be my crap that no one wants to buy, and why should I force them to get mine when there was a better version that I stopped, through copyright, from every coming to the world. Oh yeah, and what about when your copyright expires? Won't that big bad company come and run me out of business then? Yet you say I own the idea! Shouldn't my copyright last forever? I think I'll just sit on it.

EDIT: And yes, Mario is their invention, but what of innovation?



---------- Post added at 03:38 PM EST ---------- Previous post was at 03:34 PM EST ----------
NoEffex said:
No, they have no right to make the thing better and profit for the entire thing, as you, the original author and the person who spent ALL the time that you did on it got jipped out of the entire payload. It's completely unfair.
Click to expand...

Haha, what about the guy who invented the wheel? We are all infringing on his copyright. How dare you!
 
N

NoEffex

Seth's On A Boat.
Telpeurion said:
Well, lets not get into the realm of saying who deserves what, all we can say is who wants what. If the consumers like my version of Mario better than yours, complain all you want, they still like mine better. Yours is a purely hypothetical argument. If I release my product before them, wouldn't it be silly for them to advertise that they made it first when in fact they did not? Why is their product more successful than mine? Do they have better marketing? Do they have a better product itself? What stops another business from making their own version of the project? All these questions and more need to be answered.

To the point though, if I cannot sell my product, and since we are talking about "deserving" things, I do not "deserve" to be in business. After all, even if I had monopoly production of the product, it would still be my crap that no one wants to buy, and why should I force them to get mine when there was a better version that I stopped, through copyright, from every coming to the world. Oh yeah, and what about when your copyright expires? Won't that big bad company come and run me out of business then? Yet you say I own the idea! Shouldn't my copyright last forever? I think I'll just sit on it.

EDIT: And yes, Mario is their invention, but what of innovation?



---------- Post added at 03:38 PM EST ---------- Previous post was at 03:34 PM EST ----------



Haha, what about the guy who invented the wheel? We are all infringing on his copyright. How dare you!
Click to expand...

That's like saying that ps3-news was completely justified, that people used their things because they were "better", when they were simply hex modded to remove the copyrights. It's completely wrong and only worked because the individual had a larger crowd.

People would rather buy from a big monopoly than some small company that hasn't proven itself to the world. You are essentially saying that monopolies are good.

The copyright runs out because when you die you can't very well get the money, can you? If a person innovates, the individual who spent however long should get money out of it, as it's their idea that you STOLE.
 
T

Telpeurion

New Member
NoEffex said:
That's like saying that ps3-news was completely justified, that people used their things because they were "better", when they were simply hex modded to remove the copyrights. It's completely wrong and only worked because the individual had a larger crowd.

People would rather buy from a big monopoly than some small company that hasn't proven itself to the world. You are essentially saying that monopolies are good.

The copyright runs out because when you die you can't very well get the money, can you? If a person innovates, the individual who spent however long should get money out of it, as it's their idea that you STOLE.
Click to expand...

What? You bring up some fictitious case about a "big company" coming to out do me in every way and say I am for monopoly? How did this company get so big? Sheesh. And if they "stole" my idea, what stops someone else from stealing theirs? Circular logic?

You are the one talking about granting monopolies on the production of goods and services! What other monopoly is there? Haha... This is a first, I speak of reducing barriers to entry, and you say I am a monopolist, that's rich.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top