Multi E3 2010 - Your Expectations and Predictions?

[KezraPlanes]

FF XIII was only 3 disc's on the 360 not four. And it was the FMV's and audio that took up most of the space which is what they needed to compress for the 360 version. Im pretty sure the actual game content of FF XIII is very small since there really isn't much content there so I highly doubt the port to 360 fundamentally changed the overall game. Games like GTA IV, Fallout 3, or Red Dead Redemption have far more content than FF XIII yet don't need multi disc's.




Anyway all I want to see at E3 is a new slim 360, a release date for Puzzle Quest 2, and Epic to confirm the rumors that they will be using dedicated servers for Gears 3.

Nomura or Kitase (one of them) said enough content was cut from FFXIII to make a new game altogether. That's a pretty big cut anyway you slice it, and I doubt that the fact 360 uses DVD9 wasn't a factor. Nomura himself said he preffered to develop for a single console only (and he's a biased PS fanboy xD).

People might believe that FFXIII/360-problem might be an excuse from biased fanboys (and there is ground to believe so) but this is my prespective on the subject (and I don't care about exclusives or whatever, I just want to see good games):

- FFXIII started has a PS2 title;
- FFXIII was moved on to the PS3 because of the opportunities it created (Crystal Engine was developed);
- FFXIII development was brought to a halt at about 80% due to the announcement of the 360 version - delays ensue;
- FFXIII has to be "watered down" with content cutting and graphical downgrades (there are pictures to prove this point, unfortunately =\) for "equality" reasons;
- FFXIII development resumes and is concluded with a somewhat inferior game.

Now I don't blame this on the 360. At all. The ones at fault here are Square-Enix for their lazyness and stupidity. The wanted to "westernize" Final Fantasy XIII for 360 users (it is a well-known fact that 360 users come from PC gamers, mostly. And Japan was never in touch with PC gaming. EVER!) and that was a huge mistake, that came with a cost in quality.

I just don't want to see the same happening to Versus XIII. I hunger for a decent JRPG this gen.

 

[Sinfulfate]

Nomura or Kitase (one of them) said enough content was cut from FFXIII to make a new game altogether. That's a pretty big cut anyway you slice it, and I doubt that the fact 360 uses DVD9 wasn't a factor. Nomura himself said he preffered to develop for a single console only (and he's a biased PS fanboy xD).

Developers cut content from their games all the time and you can bet with a game that's been in development for like over 5 years scanning multiple platforms it will have tons of cut content. I bet with all the stuff they had to cut from games like Too human and Alan Wake the devs could have made whole other games as well.

Also as far as I know there is no limit to the number of disc you can use for 360 games so why would they have to cut content? It doesn't matter if they use one disc that holds 50gb of space or 5 disc that hold 9gbs each there still working with the same amount of space. Of course they would have to account for the fact that they have to split the content between multiple discs but they have been doing that with the FF games for awhile now.

People might believe that FFXIII/360-problem might be an excuse from biased fanboys (and there is ground to believe so) but this is my prespective on the subject (and I don't care about exclusives or whatever, I just want to see good games):

- FFXIII started has a PS2 title;
- FFXIII was moved on to the PS3 because of the opportunities it created (Crystal Engine was developed);
- FFXIII development was brought to a halt at about 80% due to the announcement of the 360 version - delays ensue;
- FFXIII has to be "watered down" with content cutting and graphical downgrades (there are pictures to prove this point, unfortunately =\) for "equality" reasons;
- FFXIII development resumes and is concluded with a somewhat inferior game.

Now I don't blame this on the 360. At all. The ones at fault here are Square-Enix for their lazyness and stupidity. The wanted to "westernize" Final Fantasy XIII for 360 users (it is a well-known fact that 360 users come from PC gamers, mostly. And Japan was never in touch with PC gaming. EVER!) and that was a huge mistake, that came with a cost in quality.

I just don't want to see the same happening to Versus XIII. I hunger for a decent JRPG this gen.

Have you even played FF XIII? FF XIII is as Japanese as it gets. There is absolutely nothing westernized about that game. Also like you(and Square Enix) has said the game was most of the way done before a 360 version was even mentioned and at that point on a 40+ hour jrpg nothing major would be changed or dumb downed. FF XIII isn't a very good game and I hate when people try to act like the port to the 360 had anything to do with that. Most of the core problems with FF XIII are all core design choices they made at the early stages of development. I personally think FF XIII suffered the same fate as Too Human and was just in development for far too long. If you want Versus XIII to turn out better all you can do is hope they don't make the same bad design decisions they did with FF XIII. There have been plenty of decent JRPGs this gen but most are on the 360. I've played and beaten most of them and I'd say Blue Dragon is the best with Lost Odyssey being a close second.

 

[KezraPlanes]

FF XIII is as Japanese as it gets.

This sentence is so wrong I don't even know where to begin.

FFXIII is as much a JRPG is Mass Effect 2 is an RPG. Nowhere. Mass Effect 2 is nothing but a 3rd Person Shooter with some (few) RPG elements. FFXIII is just a movie that from time to time requires you to touch the controller. Also JRPG are usually pretty fun but FFXIII is boring as fuck. FFXIII was transformed into something that more quickly resembles a bad action game than a RPG, therefore it was damn westernized.

Now you want to know where I blame the 360 on this? Upper management. From the moment M$ threw cash around to SE to gain rights for the game. They no longer cared about the quality. They just want to get something out that would get them some more cash, even if the quality was low, they knew the game's name itself would get them 6mil on both consoles easy.

/end rant

 

[Abe Froeman]

[HIGHLIGHT]This sentence is so wrong I don't even know where to begin.[/HIGHLIGHT]

FFXIII is as much a JRPG is Mass Effect 2 is an RPG. Nowhere. Mass Effect 2 is nothing but a 3rd Person Shooter with some (few) RPG elements. FFXIII is just a movie that from time to time requires you to touch the controller. Also JRPG are usually pretty fun but FFXIII is boring as fuck. FFXIII was transformed into something that more quickly resembles a bad action game than a RPG, therefore it was damn westernized.

Now you want to know where I blame the 360 on this? Upper management. From the moment M$ threw cash around to SE to gain rights for the game. They no longer cared about the quality. They just want to get something out that would get them some more cash, even if the quality was low, they knew the game's name itself would get them 6mil on both consoles easy.

/end rant

Please begin from the beginning.

FF13 oozes Japanese awfulness from the second it starts to the second it finishes. From every random fist pump that says "Right!" to the overdone character stereotypes that everyone has seen numerous times before. Splash in a bunch of random grunts and humor that only is funny if you like anime, because it's used in every one that's ever been created. (If you don't like anime, you might as well be listening to Sesame Street, because it's the closest thing that I can use to relate to the level of humor being attempted.) Toss in a couple pigeon toed chicks that run like dipshits and you've got FF13.

It's as linear as it gets and you need to grind massively to max out your characters if you are so inclined.

The one shining star of that game is the combat system.

Also, I now need to read all of your posts in the below person's voice to make sense of them.

 

[KezraPlanes]

Also, I now need to read all of your posts in the below person's voice to make sense of them.

[qimg]http://i49.tinypic.com/aa88yr.gif[/qimg]

Too bad I'm not a Simpsons watcher. So I'll never understand that. xD

Anyways JRPG's are in no way as awful as you claim them to be (although nowadays they all sucks except for a few exceptions) but FFXIII manages to fail even more than all those combined. The stereotypes are just offensive and late SE games and there is no originality whatsoever (read: FFXIII, Lost Oddysee, Last Remnant, Star Ocean 4 - key here: they're all 360 exclusives). But this was overdone in FFXIII to please a new audience (being the western one, garnered in the 360 deal) and that made the games suck even more.

JRPG's though, when done by people who are not in it for the money, but rather for the passion, are usually pretty awesome/fun games that give you countless hours of mindless fun. It might be just me, but with that opinion on JRPG's you might never be able to enjoy one.

 

[Abe Froeman]

Too bad I'm not a Simpsons watcher. So I'll never understand that. xD

Anyways JRPG's are in no way as awful as you claim them to be (although nowadays they all sucks except for a few exceptions) but FFXIII manages to fail even more than all those combined. The stereotypes are just offensive and late SE games and there is no originality whatsoever. But this was overdone in FFXIII to please a new audience (being the western one, garnered in the 360 deal) and that made the games suck even more.

JRPG's though, when done by people who are not in it for the money, but rather for the passion, are usually pretty awesome/fun games that give you countless hours of mindless fun. It might be just me, but with that opinion on JRPG's you might never be able to enjoy one.

There is a massive RPG userbase on the 360, I would argue a bigger one than on the PS3. (Hence, there are more RPG's on it!)

Stick that into your equation and see if it computes.

 

[FrozenIpaq]

There is a massive RPG userbase on the 360, I would argue a bigger one than on the PS3. (Hence, there are more RPG's on it!)

Stick that into your equation and see if it computes.

That's a relatively new trend though as the Playstation platform was the platform for RPGs (JRPGs at least) prior to this generation due to the Final Fantasy install base. However, this generation has shown a greater focus on the Xbox 360, probably because of its larger install base and Microsoft pushing studios (mainly Square Enix) and some side deals.

 

[Abe Froeman]

That's a relatively new trend though as the Playstation platform was the platform for RPGs (JRPGs at least) prior to this generation due to the Final Fantasy install base. However, this generation has shown a greater focus on the Xbox 360, probably because of its larger install base and Microsoft pushing studios (mainly Square Enix) and some side deals.

How exactly did Microsoft push Square Enix? Were there guns involved? Was a CEO's daughter kidnapped?

It probably went something like this:

Microsoft Xbox Exec: "Hey, we love your games and would love to have some of them on the Xbox 360."
Any Game Executive interrupting before the Microsoft Exec could finish his sentence: "YES!"

 

[KezraPlanes]

There is a massive RPG userbase on the 360, I would argue a bigger one than on the PS3. (Hence, there are more RPG's on it!)

Stick that into your equation and see if it computes.

I have to disagree Abe, and sales figures agree with me.

RPGs sells like crap on the 360 compared to most other games (read: FPS games). The 360 is a console turned more to the FPS genre, and it sells like hotcakes.

Also PS3 and 360 have almost the same number of RPGs and usually the PS3 ones are better (Valkyria Chronicles is one example and twice the game most RPGs on the 360 are). The only reason there are more RPGs on the 360 (for now) is that devs were afraid to play around with the cell, compared to the PC-like arquitecture of the 360 (which is way more accessible than the Cell). Add to that a year of advance, a cheaper price tag and M$ throwing money around to devs and you'll understand why the 360 has a little better in the RPG department.

What will happen in the future remains to be seen, but I forsee RPGs dominating the PS3 just like last-gen, while FPS will continue to be the crown of the 360.

Curiosity: One of the best RPG saga on the 360 (Mass Effect) looks more like a 3rd person shooter with some RPG elements thrown in.

Microsoft Xbox Exec: "Hey, we love your games and would love to have some of them on the Xbox 360."
Any Game Executive interrupting before the Microsoft Exec could finish his sentence: "YES!"

Wrong. It's more like:

Microsoft Xbox Exec: "Hey, we hate your games but we are willing to pay to publish games on our console just to screw Sony. LOTS of money."
Any Game Executive interrupting before the Microsoft Exec could finish his sentence: "YES!"

 

[Abe Froeman]

I have to disagree Abe, and sales figures agree with me.

RPGs sells like crap on the 360 compared to most other games (read: FPS games). The 360 is a console turned more to the FPS genre, and it sells like hotcakes.

Also PS3 and 360 have almost the same number of RPGs and usually the PS3 ones are better (Valkyria Chronicles is one example and twice the game most RPGs on the 360 are). The only reason there are more RPGs on the 360 (for now) is that devs were afraid to play around with the cell, compared to the PC-like arquitecture of the 360 (which is way more accessible than the Cell). Add to that a year of advance, a cheaper price tag and M$ throwing money around to devs and you'll understand why the 360 has a little better in the RPG department.

What will happen in the future remains to be seen, but I forsee RPGs dominating the PS3 just like last-gen, while FPS will continue to be the crown of the 360.

They don't almost have the same number of RPG's. It's very lopsided in the 360's favor. Guess what, one good game doesn't count for five when doing the math either.

I know you disagree and I also know that you are throwing out very fundamentally incorrect stereotypes about the types of gamers that are on the 360.

Your broad general strokes of opinions that you think are in tune with every game developing company that exist are laughable, and have been for a while.

 

[FrozenIpaq]

How exactly did Microsoft push Square Enix? Were there guns involved? Was a CEO's daughter kidnapped?

It probably went something like this:

Microsoft Xbox Exec: "Hey, we love your games and would love to have some of them on the Xbox 360."
Any Game Executive interrupting before the Microsoft Exec could finish his sentence: "YES!"

No, I'm saying I'm pretty sure they made some kind of monetary deal with them

EDIT: This: Square Enix on Board with Microsoft? - X360 News at IGN

 

[KezraPlanes]

They don't almost have the same number of RPG's. It's very lopsided in the 360's favor. Guess what, one good game doesn't count for five when doing the math either.

I know you disagree and I also know that you are throwing out very fundamentally incorrect stereotypes about the types of gamers that are on the 360.

Your broad general strokes of opinions that you think are in tune with every game developing company that exist are laughable, and have been for a while.

Lies.

According to VGChartz, the 360 has 41 RPGs, whilst the PS3 has 30. BUT on VGChartz, they count add-on packs as RPGs so let's take those out:

FFXI: Expansion Pack
Oblivion Expansion Pack (Shivering Isles)
2 Fallout Expansions
A FFXI compilation
2 more Fallout expansions
Another FFXI compilation

that less 6 which brings the count to 35 vs. 30. Not that lopsided.

Also I'm not being sterotypical, I just call things like I see it. Everyone I know who owns a 360 is usually a huge FPS/Action game fan. And I know lots (since there are tons of 360 around here). How is that being sterotypical?

Also I'd thank you if you did not insult my because of my "general stroke of opinions" as you call them. It's uncalled for and has NOTHING to do with this whatsoever. We all have our views of things, if you disagree, too bad. Just don't go insulting people over it.

 

[Abe Froeman]

No, I'm saying I'm pretty sure they made some kind of monetary deal with them

EDIT: This: Square Enix on Board with Microsoft? - X360 News at IGN

Way to grab an article that was made six months prior to the consoles launch indicating that were trying to make business relationships with major game developers.

What WERE they thinking?????

 

[KezraPlanes]

Way to grab an article that was made six months prior to the consoles launch indicating that were trying to make business relationships with major game developers.

What WERE they thinking?????

It's been proven that M$ pays to get timed/full exclusivity. Just like they paid 40 mil to Rockstar for long-timed exclusivity on GTA4 expansion packs, and like they paid off Bethesda for the same deal...

 

[FrozenIpaq]

Way to grab an article that was made six months prior to the consoles launch indicating that were trying to make business relationships with major game developers.

What WERE they thinking?????

I'm not saying it was bad at all; I'm just saying that the Xbox platform wasn't always the platform for RPGs. It wasn't until Microsoft made this deal that Square Enix started to come on the 360 platform (Xbox is still not "big" in Japan).

I'm just arguing that it is a NEW trend, that is all. I'm not arguing what they were thinking, whether it was good or bad, or whatever. It's new, and that's all I wanted to point out.

 

[Abe Froeman]

@Kezra - You are such a fucking rabid fanboy, I'm bowing out of this.

 

[KezraPlanes]

@Kezra - You are such a fucking rabid fanboy, I'm bowing out of this.

Typical way to bail out. Call someone a fanboy and call it a day. Suit yourself. Just so you know I do own a 360 and play on it and enjoy it. Thank you very much.

And EXCUSE me for thinking that paying off a dev studio just to screw over users of other consoles is wrong.

Sheesh

 

[FrozenIpaq]

Typical way to bail out. Call someone a fanboy and call it a day. Suit yourself. Just so you know I do own a 360 and play on it and enjoy it. Thank you very much.

And EXCUSE me for thinking that paying off a dev studio just to screw over users of other consoles is wrong.

Sheesh

The deals Microsoft has made hasn't "screwed" over other consoles. The other consoles will still get the content in terms of DLC content, and we all know that if you want DLC first just get a 360 console since Sony rarely makes deals to get DLC first.

 

[KezraPlanes]

The deals Microsoft has made hasn't "screwed" over other consoles. The other consoles will still get the content in terms of DLC content, and we all know that if you want DLC first just get a 360 console since Sony rarely makes deals to get DLC first.

That maybe so but users do eventually get screwed because they have to pay the exact same amount for something that is over 1 year old with no improvements (even with the same bugs) after being nothing more than a second choice for the content to be put.

I just don't think it's right. I mean they get a huge paycheck and then want to force other users they neglected to just splash the huge amounts of cash for something that isn't worth it?

 

[explosions]

Ignoring the console war going on, I want to see a new version of the Wii. I doubt Nintendo will offer one, but it's the only thing I really would like to happen.