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Introducing points system (EXP) and cross platform leaderboards

GENiEBEN

New Member
While I may no longer be top 5 for the foreseeable future, at least there aren't 0 EXP games anymore, so that's something.
Have you thought of adding bonus EXP for 100% games?

Edit: Will it be possible to add an 'EXP left to unlock for started games' under the Stats page?
 
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xPETEZx

New Member
Yes, it's possible to add the global unlock percentage for Steam. I think we could add it for Xbox and Google Play as well. And I just realized this stat isn't showing in the beta style yet (only on the old style), I'll get it added soon.

I'll see about adjusting the point allocation for the Blizzard games, since they are an exception. Could avoid giving EXP to achievements that don't give any points in the game, if that would be better?
Brilliant, I look forward to seeing those stats for Steam too.

Yes I think that would be a great solution. Any achievement that does not give points in-game, stands to reason it should not give them here either.
I am not sure the API brings over what 'category' an achievement is from, but any of the ones listed in game as "Feats of Strength" should be excluded in my opinion.

Thanks for the great work.
 

JSoup

New Member
However, some games seem to have taken a real hit, like Star Craft 2. This game has like 2500+ achievements apparently, but the vast majority of those will be "feats of strength" so ones that dont give points in the game, and often cant be earned after a certain point.
Clarification request:
Are you saying that the majority will be FoS earns because that's what people here mostly earn? That's true of me, I haven't really had time to dig into SC2, so it will happen.
Or are you saying that FoS make up the majority of SC2 achievements total? Because that's incorrect: https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Achievements
 
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xPETEZx

New Member
Clarification request:
Are you saying that the majority will be FoS earns because that's what people here mostly earn? That's true of me, I haven't really had time to dig into SC2, so it will happen.
Or are you saying that FoS make up the majority of SC2 achievements total? Because that's incorrect: https://liquipedia.net/starcraft2/Achievements
[/QUOTE]

SC2 apparently has 2500+ achievements, yet the highest any player has earned is like 840~.
I know I have completed a good chunk of them, and I 'only' have 767.
I already posted another topic about an issue whereby some 'stacked' achievements (IE ones where you have 10 wins, 25, 50, 100 etc) only give credit for the highest earned. So if you have achieved 100 wins, you may only show as having that, rather than also 10, 25 and 50.
Perhaps that could contribute.

It just seems odd that on a site like this the highest anybody has is 33%~. This is why I thought perhaps the FoS ones could be to 'blame', as there are lots in there for playing SC2 on a certain day or watching an event.
 

JSoup

New Member
SC2 apparently has 2500+ achievements, yet the highest any player has earned is like 840~.
I know I have completed a good chunk of them, and I 'only' have 767.
I already posted another topic about an issue whereby some 'stacked' achievements (IE ones where you have 10 wins, 25, 50, 100 etc) only give credit for the highest earned. So if you have achieved 100 wins, you may only show as having that, rather than also 10, 25 and 50.
Perhaps that could contribute.

It just seems odd that on a site like this the highest anybody has is 33%~. This is why I thought perhaps the FoS ones could be to 'blame', as there are lots in there for playing SC2 on a certain day or watching an event.
[/QUOTE]

Without looking, I'm going to take a guess and say most people played the normal mode and called it quits after that. The difficulty levels for SC2 ramp pretty hard, so it would discourage casual players. Toss in the FoS and there we go, 700 to 800 range.

On the topic of stacked achievements, if we ever get Guild Wars 2 tracking here, that's going to be an issues. 90% of the achievements are of the stacked variety.
 

x3sphere

Administrator
Staff member
Enforcer Team
The new points seems to be very good. But why are exp booster games on google play getting points now?
They should all show 0 EXP now.
 

x3sphere

Administrator
Staff member
Enforcer Team

Panthon13

New Member
I'm not sure if this was mentioned or if this is even easily possible, but it would be nice of the EXP of each achievement calculated their score using the same achievements across all games from each platform where it exists when each same-titled game has the same achievements. That way the rarity value isn't skewed based on its platform ownership/attempts.

I'm just using this game as an example since I just bought it on GOG and noticed the EXP value of it compared to the other games.

1591876748756.png
 

BigHatPaul

New Member
I'm not sure if this was mentioned or if this is even easily possible, but it would be nice of the EXP of each achievement calculated their score using the same achievements across all games from each platform where it exists when each same-titled game has the same achievements. That way the rarity value isn't skewed based on its platform ownership/attempts.

I'm just using this game as an example since I just bought it on GOG and noticed the EXP value of it compared to the other games.

View attachment 10639
Are you asking for the EXP for the same game to be the same across all platforms?
 

x3sphere

Administrator
Staff member
Enforcer Team
I like the idea and it'd be possible to implement, but there are some considerations to take into account.

1) Not all multiplatform titles have the same achievements. For example Outlast on Xbox One has a list different from the other versions
https://www.exophase.com/game/outlast-xbox/achievements/. In the case a list is different, I guess we could just exclude it from having EXP matched with the others, so it'd be calculated normally.

2) Some games are easier with KB+M so we might have to exclude those from the matching system as well. One pointed out to me was Lovely Planet (https://www.exophase.com/game/lovely-planet-steam/achievements/).

3) Some multiplatform games have broken achievements that work fine on the other platforms. Combining the earners for each achievement on all associated platforms and calculating the EXP as normal won't work well in this instance as it'll lead to some overvalued achievements. However one way to avoid that I think, would be by calculating the total EXP for each game individually and then calculate an average from that, and assign the average as the total EXP for each game in the set.
 

Panthon13

New Member
I like the idea and it'd be possible to implement, but there are some considerations to take into account.

1) Not all multiplatform titles have the same achievements. For example Outlast on Xbox One has a list different from the other versions
https://www.exophase.com/game/outlast-xbox/achievements/. In the case a list is different, I guess we could just exclude it from having EXP matched with the others, so it'd be calculated normally.

2) Some games are easier with KB+M so we might have to exclude those from the matching system as well. One pointed out to me was Lovely Planet (https://www.exophase.com/game/lovely-planet-steam/achievements/).

3) Some multiplatform games have broken achievements that work fine on the other platforms. Combining the earners for each achievement on all associated platforms and calculating the EXP as normal won't work well in this instance as it'll lead to some overvalued achievements. However one way to avoid that I think, would be by calculating the total EXP for each game individually and then calculate an average from that, and assign the average as the total EXP for each game in the set.
Games where achievements are different does kinda suck, considering the difference between Outlast 2 on PS4 vs Xbox One vs Steam or GOG is that PS4 has an additional trophy for "Collect all other trophies", which is probably common on that platform... And like you said, you would just calculate games with extreme achievement differences as you do now.

Point 2) is a difficult consideration because Xbox One and PS4 do have KB+M support, but I think it's a short list for game compatibility. But with PC, most games you can use a controller or a KB+M. There are some achievements I got with a mouse because I just couldn't do them with a controller. (FF9 jump-roping anyone?) I wonder if it would just be better to average console platform achievements together and average PC platform achievements together? That way the PS4/Xbox One community has their achievements averaged without concern of KB+M vs controller conflicts, and the PC platforms, like Steam and GOG, (and the upcoming Epic Games) have theirs averaged so when 20,000 people on Steam have played a specific game and have a good structure for EXP value, but only 3 people own the game on GOG, it's not a huge disparity of EXP value between the two launchers. I think the larger issue is that PC players are pretty biased for the DRM they are buying on, and when you consider GOG (or Epic Games right now), games are not released at the same time or the launcher/game doesn't have achievements until much later due to support or game release time.


EDIT: Oh, I guess I didn't specifically mention it, but it would be cool to see the % earned as an averaged value on each achievement as well however you decide to average EXP.
 
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SenorMexicano

New Member
While Steam does not have any form of achievement XP/score, it does have it's share of games intended solely to unlock a ton of achievements for virtually no effort.

Taking a quick look at the top player on the Steam leaderboards, many of the completed games are games like these. I think it'd be a good idea to remove these from counting towards XP and perhaps from total game completion as well as they definitely inflate it by a lot.
 

YouGotHitByGunner

Member
Staff member
Enforcer Team
In my opinion, that would be too much manual work, instead of working on tracker features. And it would get too subjective/personal. How would Exophase separate "spam games" from easy, indie or short games? Every gamer has his own perception of what that would be. And it exists on all platforms, not just Steam.

Edit: And you can still get the top place, by playing games with rare achievements. Easy games are barely worth EXP now compared to how much it used to be in the past.
 
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